tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2657266526705426756.post8345832401661355133..comments2024-03-26T04:58:54.326-04:00Comments on The Wandering Gamist: ACKS Estates - Burghersjedavishttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08586249502818922886noreply@blogger.comBlogger7125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2657266526705426756.post-44455369857315004762017-03-22T10:18:10.968-04:002017-03-22T10:18:10.968-04:00There was some stuff either in Axioms or on the bo...There was some stuff either in Axioms or on the boards, or both, about volume of trade for given market classes, which may or may not have eventual applicability.<br /><br />The MS&C table I think assumes a per-month cycle, and I'd almost think for purposes of turnaround, market size should (as it does already) correlate to range of trade, so if one just simply assumes half the traders are outgoing, and half are incoming, then there's going to be a time period of delay before the outgoing half can be conscripted.<br /><br />As smaller markets are trading in smaller rangers and tighter turnarounds, if there's any sanity applied to the process (i.e. folks aren't sitting around in Class V markets waiting for weeks 2&3 of the merchant availability cycle - it's not worth it) it might be a bit quicker - or at least might be able to be matched to the D@W conscription times for sizes of realms.<br /><br />It's well beyond the simplicity you're wanting to assume in here, but for reference, I'd made a madness-inducing spreadsheet some time ago here:<br /><br />http://autarch.co/forums/general-discussion/expanded-merchant-ships-caravans-table<br /><br />that allows one to plug in variables and get the highest profit margin for a given distance of trade, based on size of trading unit and time spent in market.<br />Koewnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01417138644425141883noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2657266526705426756.post-75598321041518380282017-03-20T19:53:10.258-04:002017-03-20T19:53:10.258-04:00Ah, I knew I'd forgotten something! I had con...Ah, I knew I'd forgotten something! I had considered putting the caravan troops in the Transport column; I agree that they're worth noting, and add to the utility of caravans.<br /><br />I honestly have no idea of "conscription" / arrival / retrieval times. I assumed a more-or-less per-season allocation to either trade or military functions. I suppose it might still come up in the event of a surprise attack (where one might desire a navy to attack an enemy's supply lines or to feed a counteroffensive). Open to suggestions I suppose.jedavishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08586249502818922886noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2657266526705426756.post-32673320149156208772017-03-20T18:03:27.495-04:002017-03-20T18:03:27.495-04:00This and the Estates before it are very compelling...This and the Estates before it are very compelling remodelings. I very much dig the transmutation of the faceless tax-paying family into a typed resource.<br /><br />What about the caravan troops? By the monster entry, every 10 wagons has 20 1st level fighters and 2 3rd level fighters...the 3rd levels being useful at the platoon scale as commanders; then there's the implied 5th level captain per caravan. <br /><br />50 wagons is a veteran company of medium infantry/xbow (chain, sword, crossbow), and you're guaranteed a 5th level commander; not a bad resource for city defense.<br /><br />I'd be curious what the turnaround time would be for conscripting ships/caravans into military support functions - what %% of the boats/wagons are out at any given time already allocated to trade, how long does it take to get them back - a'la D@W conscription times.<br />Koewnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01417138644425141883noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2657266526705426756.post-36858214702387075542017-03-19T09:03:20.724-04:002017-03-19T09:03:20.724-04:00Possibly an ACKSier way to do this would be to kee...Possibly an ACKSier way to do this would be to keep track of total trade fleet value just in gp (like fortress value), and only deal with naval units as explicit single ships (like military units). I could see that scaling better to large realms.jedavishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08586249502818922886noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2657266526705426756.post-48598624895702821402017-03-18T08:35:39.099-04:002017-03-18T08:35:39.099-04:00That makes a lot of sense, thanks.That makes a lot of sense, thanks.Tom Hudsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14295247089905712338noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2657266526705426756.post-4476612557178853762017-03-18T08:31:46.170-04:002017-03-18T08:31:46.170-04:00So my assumption here is not that these are all th...So my assumption here is not that these are all the ships that call the city their home port, or are owned by people living in the city; just those owned by the oligarchy, and whose crew serve in lieu of taxes - those readily available for the PCs to make use of. I don't have a good model of how many more ships would be "privately-owned" but available for hire (very expensive, since you need to pay for lost trade income in order to be competitive) or conscription (going to hurt burgher loyalty) in times of war.<br /><br />In the Viking case, the Leidang Laws ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leidang#Structure ) suggest perhaps switching it down to three months' service per year for a fleet four times as large, much like I did for feudal cavalry. That gives crew and supplies for one longship per ~150 families, and since a longship has a crew of 75 rower-marines, that's about half the able-bodied men.jedavishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08586249502818922886noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2657266526705426756.post-88238069257324035722017-03-18T07:01:50.985-04:002017-03-18T07:01:50.985-04:00I wonder if there are other ways to tweak fleet su...I wonder if there are other ways to tweak fleet support costs and earnings? I'm just struggling with the idea that vikings have a maximum of 1 longship per 625 families.<br /><br />My sanity check starts with Wikipedia: "By 1450, over 3,000 Venetian merchant ships were in operation, both as supply ships for Venetian merchants and as warships for the Venetian navy."<br /><br />Population then is vaguely 20k families in the city, so there's one great galley with 25 banks of rowers (100+ rowers?) per 7 burgher families. This is pretty clearly breaking the system. (Second check: at the 13th century Battle of Curzola there's between 150 and 200 crew on each great galley, if there are 14k killed or captured and 83 of 95 galleys lost.)Tom Hudsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14295247089905712338noreply@blogger.com